Moving To Italy From UK – Escaping Brexit With Italian Citizenship

Moving To Italy From UK – Escaping Brexit With Italian Citizenship

Hey hey, what’s up I’m Rafael Di Furia, AKA
Rafi Di is me, and I am back at it again on another beautiful Friday night. And this Friday night we are doing a little
bit of a different kind of video here. During my time making these videos, there
has been a request for a type of video that I haven’t quite gotten to yet. But, I have decided to embark on this extra
part of this YouTube journey that I’m on with you guys. And in this week’s video, I had the opportunity
to speak with one of you guys directly in person. There’s a man named Cesare, who I’ve had a
little bit of contact with through Instagram, and we both just happened to be in Ferrara
at the same time. I was there recording a different video which
you guys will see soon enough. If you’ve been watching my videos, recently
you may already have an inkling as to what it could be about. Many of us Italian Americans and people of
Italian descent around the world don’t necessarily get so exposed to the rest of the Italian
diaspora. Especially us Americans, at least in my opinion. So I think some of you may find what Cesare
has to say about his personal experience growing up in Scottland quite interesting and probably
a bit relatable. And if you would like to see more videos like
this, be sure to let me know down in the comments section below if you would like to see more
people talking about thinking about living life abroad, wanting to live life abroad,
Italian citizenship… whatever it might be. Let me know down in the comments section below
if there’s a specific person you would like to hear talking. Or if you know a blogger, video blogger a
creator of any sort,, even if they don’t talk about making a new life in Italy. Whatever they do, if they’re an expat or if
they’ve been an expat, send them this video and tell them to get in contact with me! My contact information is in the links below. Probably the best way to get in contact with
me would be through my website or instagram. And of course, if you would like to see more
content like this be sure that you’re subscribed with that notification bell turned on. And if you could also give this video a like
and share it with your friends that would be very much appreciated. But enough, with the intro. Let’s get right into the video… Hey hey what’s up I’m Rafael Di Furia AKA
Rafi Di is me, and I’m here with Cesare. -Hey there man. -Hey there Rafael, nice to see you. -Thank you, for coming. You know what, so what happened was, I’m recording
a video. I just got here to Ferrara, and this guy…
we’ve had a little bit of contact, and he stops me in the street “… Rafael… yo… HEY!” *laughs* … and we got chatting, and I was like, I
could see this guy is a very interesting guy, so I wanted to get his opinion on some things,
because I’m Italian American, you’re… – Scottish Italian.. yeah
– Scottish Italian, so I think we’re coming from similar backgrounds but from very different
perspectives, but we’re coming to similar perspectives as well… But, you were telling me before that you’re
interested in getting Italian citizenship, because of the whole Brexit thing. -Maybe tell the beginning of your story… – Well since I was a kid…I come from, my
father is Italian, his father is Italian. So I’ve always been Scottish Italian, I’ve
always grown up coming to Italy my whole life. I’ve always meant to get the Italian passport. I’ve started with the paperwork a couple of
times, and then I’ll get sidetracked and I don’t do it. Then, I thought after Brexit got closer and
closer. I really need to get It. 1, because I want to live in Italy one day
and secondly, for traveling. I think an Italian passport might be less…
confrontational than having a Brittish passport. – Really? You think so? – Yeah – Because of the Brexit situation? – But I think also if you look at world policies
as well. Probably…with different wars etc… I think probably will have less against Italians
than maybe British or Americans. *laughter* – It might be safer
– That’s the thing, like sometimes even traveling with an American passport, I’m kind of like
“Is this really a good idea here?” and I’m thinking you know what… I don’t mean this in a negative way, but in
a way people don’t care about Italy, and that’s not in a bad way. It’s actually a good thing, it can mean that
when you travel to a place, you don’t have to think about “oh, I shouldn’t say I’m American…” Is, Italian citizenship, is that something
you’ve always known you could get? Yeah, yeah, I’ve known since I was a kid,
that I could have that. But as I said, I’ve always, since I was about
18 I intended to get one. A couple of times I’ve gotten forms from the
consulate. I filled them out, and then I’ve had to go
get birth certificates and then I’ve just kind of stopped the process, either I thought
this is too much… too much work – It can almost become a full-time job… – It’s not just a cast of getting the certificates…
you’ve got to send them off to get “apostilled”, you’ve got to get them translated. You’ve also then got to go to the consulate
as well and get it verified that it’s a true translation. And then, in Italy you’ve also got to get
paperwork, so it’s quite… It’s probably more time-consuming everything
that you need, than probably if you do the application in Italy. Because once you’ve got everything, and you
put your application in… – Yeah, it’s a waiting game at that pont… – It’s a waiting game… -Even where I applied, it was just, the most
time-consuming thing was getting the right documents. Also because, when I was applying… It was getting the right documents, and then
I went, and then it was like getting them once, getting them twice… and them saying “oh no you need A-B-C..” But when I went back they said “you need D-E-F”
instead… But, are you thinking in the end that rather
than apply in Scottland you’re going to actually apply in Italy? Yeah, so what I plan to do is get all the
documentation I need, I’m going to pick a place… I was initially going to move to Milan, but
I think that it’s probably a bad idea… -I would definitely agree
-… too many years I was speaking to someone who had done it
in Rome. I think he said it took two years. It could be ’round about the same time if
you just do it in your own country. The consulate says sort of two to four years… – And also it depends on getting an appointment
with the consulate definitely. – Of course but, I think the big thing as
well of you do it in the UK. The consulate have to… takes them 6 months
before they even register them in Italy. Then you’ve got the backlog, then the internal
office in Italy that contact the consulate. Whereas, if you come to Italy, you’re just
dealing with the comune (municipality) locally. – It should go, in theory… IN THEORY! – In theory! This is always in theory… Because it always depends on the coumne (municipality)
definitely. Because you have some comuni (municipalities)
that are more familiar with the process and some that are less familiar. And then even if you go to your ancestral
comune, it could be that they have no clue, but if you go to a “3rd party” comune which
would act almost in like in the same way that a consulate would. And they’re more familiar, and they can just
send off what they need to send off to the coume, tell them “this is what you need to
register” – I was researching on the different comuni
websites. “Jure Sanguinis” Some of the comunis are quite good, they have
a list of what you need. Some have nothing on it. – Yeah yeah… – Interestingly here, some comuni say you
need more paperwork than others. – Yeah! – So I’m still kind of thinking in my head,
I want to be extra safe so that when I come to Italy I’ve got everything possible, so
no hope that they can send me away. The only thing I think could be a little tricky
with a British passport is that once we leave the EU…. IF we leave the EU because there’s still a
bit of uncertainty over that… They’re saying that if you’re non-EU you need
to have your passport stamped with the date that you’ve entered Italy. – But obviously, that’s not going to apply… – Right because you’re traveling within this
European Union… – Yeah – The UK is not Schengen correct? – It’s not schengen but there’s going to be
visa-free travel, so it’s not going to be need for a stamp. – You could actually go if you wanted to the
national police and talk to them and say “I need to make sure that I have my residence
marked, can you stamp my passport?” You may have to talk to a few different people,
but it is possible to do. – I think it’s a process that as I said on
the front of it, should be relatively straight forward. But, it’s something that I know how Italy
works, that no doubt we’ll have some excitement along the way. – Right
*laughter* And depending on the government that’s here
in Italy, it could go any direction at this point. – The thing I’m wondering as well is, you
know that the current regime are talking about doing away with Jure Sanguinis – Right – So I also wonder how that would affect existing
people that are eligible for Jure Sanguinis if they change it to Just Soli or whatever
they want to change it to… – No definitely, I’ve had this concern as
well. But, the way it was explained to me, I spoke
to someone at a consulate about this once and they said “look, once you’re Italian they can’t do anything
about that because you’re recognized from birth… once you’re registered , that’s it.” So my understanding is, that… okay I’m not
a legal specialist, I’m not a lawyer or anything… But, I would assume, that it should be fine,
but this is like in my videos I’ve already been saying for a couple of years now that
the doors are open now… But the question is, how much longer are they
going to be open? That’s the big question. – That’s why I think to start the process,
and I also think that actually to be honest, in some ways Italy is actually a more complicated
process. Because I know some people in the UK, it’s
very common in Brittan for people to have maybe an Irish grandmother or parent. And I know some people who can get Irish citizenship
in three months even if it’s their great grandparents. – And Irish citizenship is soo much easier
to deal with! – Basically, it’s you send a form and you
get it… Whereas in Italy it’s better because you don’t
have the residency requirements of like say five years or seven years if it comes from
“blood” But, it still complicated in a way because
there’s so much paperwork, and it’s not just a case that you need a certificate, you need
to get so many things done to the certificate. – And this is how it’s done in Italy. Beaurocracy is almost like a national sport. It’s almost right up there with soccer, football. *laughter* – Italy needs somebody to come in and just
streamline the processes because I recently got my Codice Fiscale (personal tax number) – Oh congratulations – It should have been a very straight forward
process, but I got told I have to contact the embassy in London. I contacted the embassy in London…. I didn’t hear anything. I tried again… resent the forms… They came back to me two weeks later and said
because you’ve got an Italian last name we need to do more checks. So I thought, well okay, I sent birth certificates
as well. Which you shouldn’t need to do. Then they came back to me and said, because
you live in Scotland, you actually have to go to the consulate. Then I had to go to the consulate, but I got
it eventually. Even that took quite a long time to do. – There’s always a process…. there’s always
“oh you need this stamp to get that stamp” It’s again another thing I’ve talked about
in my videos. There’s this closed circle loop, and wherever
you can insert yourself into it… – In theory if you had all the paperwork,
and you went to the local comune because it’s the mayor needs to stamp it. In theory it an be done in one day if everything
was there – For citizenship you’re saying? – Yeah yeah – In theory it could be done in a day.. – No deffinately… – However, in Italy, no doubt it sits on one
person’s desk for probably 3 months then it goes to somebody else’s… – Well it’s a little bit more than just a
stamp. It’s also a registration process, because
the Jure Sanguinis process for people who are going through this born abroad who haven’t
had that recognition, it’s a delayed birth registration… So first they have to… I mean in your case it’s your father who came
from Italy, or your grandfather? – My grandfather – So in your case it would be that they would
have to talk to the comune where your grandfather is from. Then from there they have to register and
make sure that your grandfather’s marriage or whatever happened in Scotland, is all registered
in the comune, this “ancestral comune”. Then your father’s documents… Including birth, marriage and all of these
certificates and then to you. And then finally, once all of those are registered,
then the mayor can actually say “fine this guy is kosher” *laughter* – Stamp it and then you can get your carta
d’identita (Italian ID card) passport and in theory you should be Italian… – In theory
*laughter* This is always in theory. But what was the real motivation for wanting
to do this? You were telling me that you a bit of business
around the continent? – Yeah, I’m a professional football (soccer)
agent. So, I’ve got clients just now in Poland, Hungary,
Scandinavia, I’ve got players all over Europe and I travel a lot to watch the games, speak
with clubs… I’ve also come to Italy to watch football,
football clubs, I want to try and break into the Italian market. But, I think there’s probably a lot of people
who would probably identify with, when you grow up, and you’ve got, I fell like almost
two nationalities… in Scotland, nobody really considers you Scottish. They think you’re Italian. – Right – Probably the same in America? – It’s this thing, you never have to say that
you’re Italian, it’s like “you’re Italian, of course, you’re Italian, you have a last
name that’s Italian. What else would you be? Because anybody can be American, so, the ancestral
nationality is what takes precedence generally. I don’t know if the same or similar in the
UK? – Yeah, so if you grow up with an Italian
name, people always think “ah you’re not really scottish, you’re Italian.” You come to Italy and people think no.. – You’re Scottish! – You’re Scottish! *laughter* Even like some people, I say I’m Italian and
they get so offended. They say “no you can’t be Italian, of course
you can’t, that’s ridiculous, get out of here!” *laughter* – You feel like you never really have a country
because in the UK you feel you maybe identify a lot with the Italian culture You come to Italy you identify with the Italian
culture, but you never going to be fully accepted because you’ll always have an accent. And people always think “yeah but okay, you’re…
you know…” – Your Italian actually I heard a little when
we were ordering. It’s actually pretty decent… convincing
accent – A lot of practice, I was in Naples last
moth, I couldn’t understand a word anybody said. – In the south, the way that they speak, the
accent, not only the accent, but also the dialects are just crazy different! – Napoli “a different kettle of fish” I’ve spent a lot of time in Milan. Milan is I think is relatively easy to learn. It’s not such a difficult accent, they speak
relatively… – Very nasal though – … very sort of simple Italian But, because it’s so international, the only
problem you have in Milan is because then you’re foreign… they want to practice English. – Yeahh… – So then sometimes you want to really practice
Italian, and it’s difficult. – Yeah I get that sometimes, not so much where
I live in Rovigo now… One of the reasons why I moved there is because
there’s so few people who can speak English. And even like when I was living in Alto Adige,
I would go to the meat store, the guy behind the counter saying “hey how are you doing?” “I’m doing great! Why are we speaking English?” He wasn’t even an English speaker, he was
a German speaker… You just into this rhythm that, “okay fine,
I’m the token English speaker” Did you feel any real urgency, as soon as
the Brexit situation came along? Or, was it felt more similar before and after? – Since growing up as a kid I always identified
as Italian more. Even when Italy have played Scotland in football,
I’ve always supported Italy. At one point, I think when I was maybe 20,
there was a game between Italy and Scotland that was… I think the playoff to go to the European
championships…. I almost got my head kicked-in in a pub because
I had my Italy t-shirt on. *laughter* – YOU TRAITOR! HOW DARE YOU! *laughter* – I’ve always supported Italy whatever they
play I mean, even if it’s the Olympics, Italy is
not necessarily great in the Olympics… Rugby, six nations, Italy is terrible, but
even if Italy plays Scotland, I hate rugby as well, but I support Italy. So I think, as I said…. if you grow up,
you know… I suppose it depends…. You can have an Italian name, but it’s generations
down the line – Yeah… – And it depends on your family But I’ve always been coming to Italy since
I was, maybe … four or five…. – Oh wow… So, it’s always been a part of you, not just
your name. Because your name is Cesare, like that’s your
actual name, that’s on your documents… – Yeah yeah… – So even when we were first in contact on
Instagram, I wasn’t sure is this guy Italian or like is he Italian-something? – It’s probably the most Italian name you
can get… – Yup – But I don’t look at all Italian. I probably look a lot more British than Italian. But I’ve always, as I said, my plan has always
been to live in Italy… I’ve been close to doing it a couple of times,
and different things in life happen. You think, “okay I’ll do it” and then you
go down a different path… As I said, I’ve tried to start the process
a few times, but then once I realized how much paperwork you need…. It’s just kind of like been “you know what? I’ll do this later…I’l do this later…” But for me with Brexit… It never really bothered me, because I thought
to myself, it doesn’t matter either way because I’m born in Brittan, I have a Brittish passport… I could always live in Brittan and I could
always come and go as I please in Italy, as well so it’s… I think that maybe not Brexit maybe makes
it a bit more urgent. But it’s not been the driving factor. – Cesare, really man… thank you so much
for sitting down with me. I look forward to finishing, we’ve got some
delicious cookies here and I think we need to break into these. So anyway… Thank you for joining me on another beautiful
Friday night. If you would like to help make more videos
like this possible you can go to Http:// to help on a monthly basis or if you would
like to help out just once you can go And Cesare where can they find you online? – Instagram, @CesareM85 – I’ll put link on the screen so people can
find you I hope you all have a great weekend and a
wonderful week coming ahead. I’ll see y’all next Friday… Later!


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    Photographe Demode

    I guess I'm not the only one overwhelmed by the paper work. The thing for me is getting the docs "apostilled" found someone who can do it for me but it is the extra costs. True, you keep saying, "I'll do it later, I'll do it later, I'll do it later".
    If I had money to burn I'd go through one of the Italian Citizenship Agencies, they handle everything for several thousand euros. For some this probably would be the best option, it isn't an option for me.

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    La Cuoca Cucina

    I found this all interesting. I don't have one specific nationality I identify with, since I am made up of at least four or five different ones(none of which are Italian, but nobody's perfect, lol!). It is interesting to know that a lot of things are the same among people throughout the world, though. That is one thing the internet has helped me understand.
    Anyway, thanks for introducing us to your guest!

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    LA L

    Hi Rafael, I have a question about gaining Italian citizenship via a 1948 case and I think you might be able to give me some advice. I am asking about the possibility of me going through my Italian-born great-great- grandmother for my Italian citizenship. I'm choosing my great x2 grandmother as my Italian citizen-ancestor because I have all her Italian documents and I have to go through her daughter, and her daughter, then my mother anyway, so it's a purely 1948 case with only women. My great x2 grandmother married my great x2 grandfather in Italy in the 1980s. He was born there as an Italian citizen but had moved to America a few years before. We don't know if my great x2 grandfather naturalized in America and we can't find a record for him in USCIS, but there is one for my great x2 grandmother that was filed in 1961 according to USCIS, so I assume that's the year that she would have naturalized. My great x2 grandparents had my first generation American ancestor in 1907, my great x2 grandmother. MY great x2 grandfather disappeared after 1910 and we can't find anything about him afterwards.

    My question is, was my great x2 grandmother's Italian citizenship safe for Jure Sanguinis purposes to pass it down to her daughter even if she married a naturalized citizen in Italy? The fact that a naturalization file exists for her so late in her life looks like she was not recognized as an American citizen, so even if she married a naturalized citizen, could she have passed on her Italian citizenship to her children and down to me? I am still looking/collecting documents for my case, but any assistance and/or advice you can give me knowing the details listed above would be a lifesaver. Considering I will need to go through a lawyer for my 1948 case, I want to know that my case has a good chance before I commit that kind of money for a lawsuit.

    Thank you for reading!

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    David Carmosino

    I found the incoherence of the NY consulate frustrating in regards to what documents I needed. Three different appointments three different answers !

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    Lenny Blandino

    Nice video guys, I think there could be a mixture of jus sanguinis and jus soli in Italy in the future, like other countries.

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    The Rock Bronx

    I was born in UK of Italian parents… I have italian and UK passports…. I feel more italian 100%….even though I grew up in UK….my soul is Italian….my spirit…my culture…I now live in Rome ….worked in hotels …now searching for work

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    Gina Danna

    Very interesting..I got my Italian citizenship this year thru my father's bloodline. Growing up, me and my sisters constantly told everyone that we were Sicilian. Drove my mother slightly nuts (her family were colonists from England 1600s). So I know, I've always had a pull toward Italy. A driving need to go there, to identify with my Italian side. Now, I can! (Both of my parents are dead, so I think my dad would smile and I can see my mother roll her eyes.) I have always been very proud of my Italian heritage/spirit/soul. Thankful!!

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    Haupia Nacorda

    Where's the Scottish in this guy? I only see Italian. Seriously, this was a pretty interesting video. I love how Cesare identifies with his Italian side and that's really awesome. I have zilch Italian blood in me although FamilyTreeDNA says I have a small percentage of Spanish so I'm nearby. Thanks to you and Cesare for this enlightening topic.

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    Joe Manginelli

    Rafi, I loved your episode this week! Very cool having a different perspective. Great show and great audio also. Thanks Rafi. -Joe

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    Darin Lucas

    Another interesting video Rafael. I enjoyed the interview, but I would like to recommend spending a little less time on your video introductions. It was well over 2 minutes of an 18 minute video as usual. Keep up the great work and hope you continue to meet new friends to interview!

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    Nicole O Scott

    Can you maybe discuss for someone wanting to move to italy it has no italian family connection. How would one go about obtaining citizenship or going through the hoops if any, to make it easier to try live work etc there esp after Brexit. Thanks.

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    Scottish – Italian.
    Awesome mix.
    If we only think about how many inventors and scientists these two places have produced…
    Not only Bell and Meucci, uh! 😁

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    I moved to a property I’ve bought in Italy just over 3 months ago (from the uk) I don’t have any Italian lineage. Following the government website advice I went to the local police to say I’m planning on being here longer than 3 months an eventuality want citizenship. The police basically said they didn’t care lol, an sent me to the local council. So I went there an the councillor basically said the same. Basically she said something along the lines of “until Brexit happens your still an EU citizen so you don’t actually need to register being here”
    It’s made more complicated as well as the property I bought doesn’t actually have an address. It’s just land so she also said until I have an official residence I couldn’t really register.
    It ain’t an easy time to move to Italy from the uk.

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