Sovereign Citizens, Oath Keepers, American Spring…oh my!


you know I’m I’m been learning and
reading and seeing and hearing a lot about everything from you know if this I really can’t burst
into public view I think with the live in Bondi thing although there were a the the sovereign citizen movement in
the Oath Keepers were were hot in the news a year or two ago a
sovereign citizen movement is popped up a number times from 95-97
2003-2010 a budget sovereign citizens the shot
outta typically law enforcement officers in in
killed a bunch of arm but there’s there’s like all these
different kind of moving pieces to the were not really quite sure that
we trust the federal government to mention I love a I’m not even sure subcultures the
right word i i’d I don’t mean that in any kinda negative
way arm in the United States and so I wanted to
get Richard Mack on Sheriff Richard Mack I
ease the is a borough is on the board directors are both keepers dot org is not the sure fact I think that’s what it is Yahoo up the
Oath Keepers movement and a former arizona sure from Graham County are you
were down there with Clive in bundy we talked
a few times when that happened and what personal welcome back to the
program well thanks for having me and and I want to reiterate something
really quick as far as my introduction what everybody understand that the
reason I’m here today to reunite sake reason I’m involved with all this is
because when I was sure from Arizona actually because the administration and won a landmark cases US Supreme
Court on the issue a state sovereignty and so that’s kind of a preface for why
I’m anything are and involved at all okay so
tell us what their case well it was a person to the brady bill
in the brady bill is the first time in American history where shares actually stood up sued the
government and one and this was also the first time in
American history where the United States Congress and the president clinton in
this particular case sold the shares that we are commandeer
use with thirty 30 whether you like it or not for not
allowing you any input no control now no contractual agreement and no
negotiation you will do this for us because we
shared so we passed a large so you’re good it and they threatened to arrest us if
we fail to comply let me say that again the federal
government commandeered us for federal building under a threat
arrest if we fail to comply I said no way I was a for sure to file
the lawsuit six other sheriffs join me in the
lawsuit and what man we said the federal government
has no authority to tell us what to do they could past five thousand laws and
that still doesn’t make ’em our boss and I I you know we should have just said no
does they’re not our boss whether they’d make a la that they are not they cannot make law that they are the boss above the sheriff’s or other
elected officials in any state so is is your opinion that the federal law doesn’t that that the
job for sure of is to enforce sure such a berkeley County Sheriff’s
out there are they not yes okay so so that your job is to
enforce the laws up the county not necessarily the state
or the federal laws do I get real estate this is the county
makes very few laws the state really makes most of the laws
and we r sworn though we are sworn to uphold
the fan the supreme law of the land which is the
Constitution right in my case actually even brought that up what happens to an officer we have to
choose between a very obvious constitutional provision
in principle or obey state statutes but does not the
constitution specified that that congress makes the lawns well they
they do at the federal level but they have only
certain your such a moron you have for instance the Constitution only allows
the federal government’s 5 law enforcement authorities and we can list a more
quickly Chur a laws against nations for treaties
any violation of the treaty between us in Mexico the FBI would investigate piracy
threesome counterfeiting and they’re required to
protect our borders those are the 5 law enforcement
authorities constitutionally granted to the federal government where do you
finally go out like that authority what do we do just go along are you art
but now I you know I see someone in Article three
is that is that where you find them area this article 1 section 8 article
one section of the Constitution Article one Section eight right there most of them are in their
treason is actually in a later section yeah but the yeah they’re
they’re all common in there in fact the federal
government in Article one Section A only gets 17 assignments their duties are enumerated and discreet
just like my supreme court decisions that yeah I know I’m quite familiar with them
but for the majority but you know article one up satins one article 1
section 8 says the cut congress why the power to lay and collect taxes duties
imposts and excises to pay the debts and provide for the
common defense and general welfare the United States if you read Alexander Hamilton in the
Federalist Papers where he talks about the general welfare
clause in the Constitution he says basically we wrote this is
broadly as we could so that future legislatures could determine what the
needs of the country were what the general welfare means and you
know he was insane so that a sheriff could determine that I E well he yes he did a actually he did and the when it comes to if you re
Jefferson and Madison in response to that Hamilton really was
the most a kroll in the biggest the family
fathers and a big central government he was a POS
mostly by Madison and Jefferson another yeah car
from the ramp at Hamilton really was a big a
big-government guys but even see would be turning over in his grave if
you if he were able to see what monster we have created what to
where ru they place overall a very natural
resource air education healthcare right all that Hamilton would absolutely be turnovers is grave over Ryan so help me understand
that the the as ish as a county sheriff you’re
saying that you’re not bound by federal law on in year therefore not bound to enforce federal law they can’t make you
enforce federal laws but you don’t know yet but you’d they can if it’s Kevin Scott
on understanding its constitutional or the sheriff works for the people in this
county under the promise %uh he will uphold and defend the US
Constitution right if you read the constitution
specifically the a hamilton’s gesture or suggestions that a the general welfare clause gives
the federal government are watch would pretty much negate the rest
to the Constitution the the Supreme Court decision in my
case states clearly that they will ranted only discrete enumerated powers and such was when did express by the
implementation I love the tenth amendment so we have to
enforce the tenth amendment the states in the county’s and the
people there and enforce the temperament the the federal government does not
enforce state sovereignty the federal government is always the one
destroyed it and so there has to be a healthy balance
a power between the states and the federal
government and we do not have a healthy balance a power today and
that’s where the states and counties and sheriff’s Amanda make sure the federal government
doesn’t cross the boundaries now when you were at Clive in bunnies
ranch he asked all the sheriff serve the country to
disarm federal officers and a why would he say that well I think you seen the militarization
the federal government where even the Department of Education out as
uses watching to go after eight men in Stockton
California because his estranged wife who didn’t
with their they did a SWAT team raid to collect her unpaid student loan yeah how ridiculous
is got my don’t disagree with that but but why County Sheriff’s disarming several of
the federal government what provides you with the authority to
disarm a an FBI agent for example well it would
he I don’t care an FBI agent is larger but
I do care that the lamb and EPA and FDA and Department education and so on and
so forth all these other federal agencies are clogged I’ll wire–the buying up a two-point to billion dollars worth of for 2.2 billion I rounds of ammunition
yeah sheriff mack: you stick around with the
spillover yes you’re going to get a few minutes I we’re just going to roll short break
your will be back in just a sec Sheriff Richard Mack on the line with us both keepers .org this is the Thom Hartmann program and I
believe sure back yeah sheriff mack: dot com I as well his
his own website will be right back chair Mac is still with us yessir Tom welcome back we’ve we’ve we’ve lost a
few of our commercial affiliates are on break right now but our all of our viewers on free speech TV in
our non-commercial affiliates are with us which is no solidly have our audience
and and and also you know what archive this on
youtube I so you were explaining that Unohana actually I think we can find a
lot of areas are agreement where the federal government
has gone way beyond its mandate I could start with the NSA but you know
it’s a but in any case you were my question my question to you
then you’re kinda asking at the office with my question to you is when the federal government goes too far
supposed to do something about it the fence why go too far believe that
they’re they’re only check-and-balance that is not with the Constitution sir
well this is this is the question that Patrick Henry’s her father in law
and i’m for it his name now but he was the Chief Justice the Virginia Supreme
Court he wrote a letter to Thomas Jefferson back during jefferson’s presidency after
after the 1803 Ammar reverses Madison decision and Jefferson was loudly saying you know
how dare the Supreme Court say that they have the right just strike down laws
made by congress that’s not the constitution in fact it’s a violation of
article 3 section to the Constitution and I believe he was right and so I justice roan a.m. my memory is slowly coming back to
a and he was Spencer Roane was his name comments sent Jefferson letter saying
well if the supreme court doesn’t decide what is the law who does or what is
constitutional who does and Jefferson replied to him the people
themselves he said I don’t I don’t trust the institutional power %uh any branch in and at the time you
read this letter is present I States I don’t trust the institutional power any
branch I trust the people at the ballot box and
so if they believe that the congress has overreached in past and
unconstitutional law or if they believe that the president
has overreached and engaged in an unconstitutional activity then I trust that the people themselves
will remove these people from office at than at the next opportunity and
that’s why we provided you know I was represented stroll over
every two years the third the Senate every two years and a you know that that’s so the answer
your question would be a at the ballot box well i think i I
don’t think so I hope he said just by voted I think he
said the people themselves yes and working locally to establish a the barriers Madison said we can safely
rely on the disposition a state legislatures to erect the
barriers against you both the National Authority that too is
in the federal well yeah and and and and and if you
look at the context that conversation he was talking about OD if you’ll be kind not just by voters
well you know when Madison said that I can go back and
read Patrick Henry’s and I think you’ll find this fascinating read Patrick Henry n George Mason
speeches at the Virginia ratifying convention the Constitution they both went on at
length about how concerned they were that
article 1 section 8 gave the US government the power to have an
army because they were concerned p.m. and that is another reason that you
can use a reason why we gotta believe rights because he said
he smelled a rat he equates why we got the second I’m Mr
it’s why we got the same mm because he was the largest slave holder in Virginia
and he said if you get anti-slavery people in the in the in the government they
will p.m. in the and yet they will use article 1 section
8 to create a federal army that’ll come into Virginia and disarm us and that’s why a second
that was passed was too keep the slave trolls they called them
stay palacios at the time but I think I think it went much deeper than
that well hit there were multiple dimensions to it now as bees with but hang on to say we had to take another
one is short breaks will continue the conversation way back down here you idea for the saint among us that
we’re talking with Sheriff Richard Mack Richard back dot
com is website he’s also on the aborted directors both
keepers ok keepers .org what dr. are you part of the sovereign
citizens movement do you subscribe to this notion that no your name is in all caps not at all okay
now so what separates what your world view from the world view of
this night several hundred thousand people
out these peep the sovereign citizens arm who are refusing to pay federal
taxes and who think the the you know basically either
in the civil war or 1933 that the our identities got split
into a corporation and a real person always kinda strange stuff well you know I’m not discounting
everything they stand for I but I and this can mean a lot of
methodologies and so yes you know the tourist just
don’t meet because at that right I you know one thing that they
have a real problem with is asking for permits to do everything we
do in our country and I kinda agree with that those do we actually have to go last
mother may i to the government before we can drive a car and use our own property a you know but
those are such Monday teams innocuous issues
when we’re talking about real freedom issues and some that we
were just discussing like the right to keep and bear arms and that the federal government believes
it has regulatory authority over these rights that were considered
god-given untouchable how and when we have a federal
government goes to the bunny ranch says where you can exercise freedom of
speech as long as you do it inside the makeshift well that we just
created and constructed and if you do freedom of speech outside
that we will arrest you see that’s the kinda idiocy i’m talking
about. and would give the federal government
and we give Barack Obama way too much other past and an easy girl through collecting two hundred dollars
through the monopoly a hazy is created in this country we
give them far too much of a pass when they destroy Liberty that’s guaranteed within our
Constitution and I still ask the question when the
federal government does that who do we have to depend on to erect the
barriers against such as celeb you might do that other places but
you’re not doing it in my county yeah while I and my answers
the ballot box in your answers apparently an armed citizenry not no I mean the ballot box how’s that been
working for spoke the Democrats and Republicans have a continued the Pepe perpetuation up my
husband I think it’s gonna mouse I I blame the Supreme Court there that are
in our Constitution they’re not upholding its I Optoma do
but they don’t who was there at the bunny ranch to try to stop people from
peekskill booster whether a democrat or republican
from Washington DC to try to stop this carnage yeaa hand a
second-year just JF just to close this topic out how is grazing your animals on federal land freedom again I not
paying for it %uh freedom of speech I mean if I bought
a goat staked out doubt across the street here trying very
hard house the it’s the right to the pursuit of happiness but freedom a speech was been destroyed
their by our own government heart wanted to go their protest I protest whereby
what I can carry a sign I can carry a
megaphone and say whatever I want freedom of
speech is work Utah and the decision about this was already decided in the age khaste
when the ranchers in nye county nevada went
through the same thing that the bunnies did and why is it so we’re not answer asking
questions about why our own government is destroying the
farms in San Joaquin Valley in California by turning off the water
why is it that they’re just like what they’re having a drought aren’t they in it well is no you did not look at
yourself I just kick back and they have they have destroyed a
hundred thousand jobs their destroyed farms by turning off the
water in the name other environmentalists their destroyed
this when the regiment in the West looting in Clark County
where mister bundy is 50 third rancher being
attacked and destroyed everyone else all 52 other ranchers and
Clark ami are gone right there moving these guys
are federal land I is federal government because the lands were not a water anybody to try to look at had
intricacies about why funny shouldn’t be there and stared
why the federal government is destroying the ranching industry and that’s our
food supply in this country then we’ve got so should anybody be able
to just not just start a ranch on federal land oh
well they did this way before they head and then you we get into the argument
where did they get on federal land why do they get or set up the EPA
restriction the find people fifty thousand dollars a day without
were an act like they’re just all the wires because congress passed the law well which is provided for in the
Constitution around prior problems and why is it do you want to talk about the
federal government problems they can to discuss the federal
government is to monstrous to to manages to shoot its due diligence
and then we come up with a problem that has existed for 15-20 years and the VA you know do we need to talk about do we
need is a what be a veterans are dying literally on the
streets on because the fabricated waiting list and
we need to wonder what we’re doing as a government and
we’re gonna make XQ what would be the excuse is that well
well you know you know and there’s hardly any but
there still people making excuses and given this administration a free
test I didn’t like the Bush administration I
don’t like this one either they were both socialistic they’re both
unconstitutional they both accept no responsibility for
the problems they create but what sandy what’s the alternate with
greater with we have a rancher been destroyed by
our own government we should be asking the federal government lot bigger questions then why do we have
somebody that’s been Ranch Road we just we just
have a minute before we’re gonna hit a heartbreaker I’m sorry are just a II what’s the alternative
quite a question i mean when we had for a with under private
health insurance yet forty 45,000 Americans dying every year because it in math have access to health
insurance or because health insurance companies were saying now we’re not gonna pay for you you have
a previous condition or you didn’t you forgot to tell us they’re not supporting
the substitute the the this us to the federal government
coming in and saying we will now control your life and you
know I’m I’m asking if I’m here to stay and I i’m asking if the VA which is
socialist medicine is not working well it and we tried for-profit medicine and tens of
thousands of Americans died every year what’s the alternative the alternative is first and foremost
Mike government now to my life and leave me alone my own affair so let
us deal with a big corporation Liberty at the Liberty okay I you know I really enjoy these
conversations I I his Sheriff Richard Mack thanks so
much for be copied by anytime they could good value in the
sheriff mack: tacked on his website knees on the border both keepers of the
first time be right back you’re listening to the
Thom Hartmann program call 866 987 thon its interesting to I have a an honest once into the world view approx lecture a plus

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